Power delivery of KX verses CR

[CR480R]

Thats a good idea Because cr500s suck ass. just like the jack asses that run around preaching how great they are.

Who posted on here preaching about CR500's being great? I merely stated that I thought mine was a decent machine, and Mick stated that his CR was nearly equal to HIS KX... Why are you are you so bitter about two people disagreeing with you? Do you lose sleep at night knowing there are people out there who dont consider the CR's to have a powerband like a mechanical bull? If so you might consider therapy...

[Mick]

I don't think Honda's aluminum frame makes anything faster.  It's taken them a number of designs now to finally get it working well.  I just don't recall Kawasaki's perimeter design in the '90s working well with the 500 is all.  I'm sure their current chassis works better.

Yeah my KX is a little dated, even by 500 standards.  Still runs like a locamotive though    But no steel framed 500 is really a pleasant ride once it gets serious.

Track conditions can make competing on a 500 difficult.  But I'm no Pro rider.  In the A / B classes there isn't any downside to riding a 500AF.  For those of you who do ride 500 conversions you should have an idea what it's like...my CR just doesn't cause as much gyro effect on the chassis as you're used to.

BDI I meant we could go offroading!  I've only recently started racing MX.  Trails are my bread and butter.  And the AF is quite the trail bike.  I guess you ride a Honda on the trails also.  I think that's great...I only ride my KX in the desert too.

I'm not sure way the topic has gone so far off base.  I've said it once and I'll say it again.  The KX is faster then a CR.  And is better suited for the dunes than anything else.  Maybe folks got confused because I said the Honda has a good motor?  I guess I like it because it makes a lot of juice in the mid range where I ride most and builds power as fast as I want it to.  The KX feels like an XR in comparison.  Just kind of sluggish and non responsive *shrug*  And then of course the KX will scream until the cows come home.  Something I don't think any CR could ever do.  As much fun as it is to do 5th gear wheelies at the dunes on the KX, the motor's combersome heavy gyro feel just doesn't go well with serious track or trail use.  And no steel or alloy perimeter frame in the world is going to fix that.

We don't need to get all hot and bothered under the collar over this.  We can all agree to disagree I guess.  I would much rather see some more brilliant ideas from Stewart on how to make my green bike go faster.  That is way I'm here...not to argue over how some guy's didn't have their CR's running for crap.

[CR480R]

No why do you take everything I say out of context If you read my post I said in seven years my bike looped on me four times. I blame that solely On the crapy design and power out put of the of the cr500. But I have two ass holes saying Im stupid I can't ride and my bike must be clapped out And then you say Im saying s**t I never said like the bike is unridable and it bucks like a mechanical bull and Im full of bull s**t like I just decided to make some s**t up If you go back to the first page other people said the same thing I did.

Actually BDI, I think it may be you that is reading into this too much... I have not posted one thing about you being stupid or unable to ride... I only said it would be foolish to assume ALL CR500's behaved the same as YOURS did... I also said the video links that you posted did not support your "pipey" arguement ... Not a big deal it's just a forum and that is my opinion... Its unfortunate that you view my posts as personal attacks rather than just a simple debate... If an experienced dirtbike rider had never ridden a CR500 before (like the guy that started this thread)heard your description of the CR they would most likely be afraid to ever get on one... The throttle doesn't open itself... Sure the lighter rotating mass allows quicker throttle response that could potentially cause surprising situations if being careless when traveling from sticky to slick ground with the throttle wicked...  But at no point in the rpm range with traction has any CR500 I have ridden ('88,'90,'95,'96,'01) had a rider ejecting hp spike or hit in the power delivery...Most CR's are in a very mellow state of tune...  I admit its very easy to see how the PV lacking CR with the port timing and compression alterations could become pipey(like the CR80 you used for earlier for comparison)and difficult to ride, or how the lack of a PV limits the potential broadness of the powerband... But how would a exhaust valve benefit the low-end power characteristics of a honda when the bike is already tuned for a low-mid range output to begin with? Variable port timing just allows more top-end power to made with out sacrificing bottom end. A PV isnt going to fix the characteristics caused by a light rotating mass... Did you ever try adding some flywheel mass to better suit your needs?

[FuriouSly]

Hehehe...  might need to give this thread a break if there is no real "new" info that pertains to the title...  CR5 power is great because I like the hit, similiar to a Yamaha Banshee - fun in the sand with some decent low end grunt and the bar/seat postion puts you a bit more forward to help with the geometry.  A CR5 is a better hillclimb/drag race motor because it creates power immediately like a Banshee (which is still king of the hill).

KX5 power is a bit weak/sluggish on the bottom developing great midrange and signing off about 7/8 throttle.  More like a Four Stroke powerband which is better for the track than a CR5 in my opinion.  You can build a KX5 motor for track in a newer Aluminum frame and work on the traction issue (tires, clutch, suspension) and have a very competitive nice handling piece of machinery.  You can also build a KX5 for the desert/sand and have a very ridable bike with a super manageable powerband.

CR5=drags/climbs/desert/open sand - very physically tiring powerband to the rider which needs more throttle/clutch control for tighter riding disciplines

KX5=track/tight and open sand/desert - more layed back stock geometry which makes it bad for the track but great for open riding.  Powerband is more user friendly for technical slow speed riding.

Granted modified motors and frames change alot of the variables but so does a rider.

Sly

[KXFARMBOY]

I am so sorry, I started this thread just looking for info on these two bikes, since I am interested in buying one of them. I did not mean to start a war, I'm really not a troublemaker. Please let this be the last post on this thread!

[FuriouSly]

I am so sorry, I started this thread just looking for info on these two bikes, since I am interested in buying one of them. I did not mean to start a war, I'm really not a troublemaker. Please let this be the last post on this thread!

Don't sweat it KXfb.  BDI likes to flex his forum skills from time to time.

It really depends on how you want to ride the bike.  Track, desert, sand, hills, trails/mountains, or just all around.  A 500 is alot of bike for just cruising around and is usually riden or built by more experienced riders that are tryin to fill a niche to its fullest.

A general question as vague as yours will always tend to have the thread go off in different directions, so keep your inquiries focused to get the answer you may be looking for.   

On a side note:  the CR5 has "WAY BETTER" fit and finish than a KX5.  More refined with better quality control and design to its parts/manufacturing.

Sly

[kieran]

Oh this thread is entertaining

Keep in mind that jetting has a lot to do with the power delivery. If you're boggy rich through the midrange, and  crisp and lean up on top, its really going to launch when you get to the band.
Especially if you don't have a powervave

Jetting could make all the difference between a  rideable cr500 and a backflipping widowmaker

[Paul]

BDI, cool it. I didn't start this place so people could come along and talk like sailors. It's my understanding David asked you once before to knock it off, I'm not going to ask you. I'm going to tell you to settle down and get your head on straight. I built this place with the simple idea of accumulating the highest level of knowledge and the best members around - that includes children and those with no interest in reading your cussing.

Last warning, step out of line again and kiss your access good-bye.

To everyone else, keep this thread civil or I'll close it - this type of thing can easily become a 'religious debate'.

[gowen]

Don, your aluminum frame KX is to die for. Very very very very nice.

[don46]

Don, your aluminum frame KX is to die for. Very very very very nice.

Thanks, I wasn't going to do it but all the pieces kinda fell into place so I couldn't resist. It was fun building but now that it's done I'm wondering whats next. I'm thinking maybe an Aluminum 250 2t, guess I'll have to wait and see.

[bigbellybob]

on my little 380 i have only lost a race to a KX500. im still looking for a CR500 that will hang with it.
i will be @ dunmont presidents day with the little 380. let me know if you would like to put your cr500 in check.

[doordie]

BDI, cool it. I didn't start this place so people could come along and talk like sailors. It's my understanding David asked you once before to knock it off, I'm not going to ask you. I'm going to tell you to settle down and get your head on straight. I built this place with the simple idea of accumulating the highest level of knowledge and the best members around - that includes children and those with no interest in reading your cussing.

Last warning, step out of line again and kiss your access good-bye.

To everyone else, keep this thread civil or I'll close it - this type of thing can easily become a 'religious debate'.

AGREE!

[TheGDog]

This Is a good example of what Im talking about this is a cr500 under heavy load listen to the engine and how it labors when Its not on the pipe. watch the vid a couple of times and pay attention to how the engine goes on and off the pipe and  how abruptly the power comes on. Now imagine ridding that bike with a stock wheel base on steep mountain trails with rocks and shale Like where I live and you may understand why I do not miss that bike.
   
                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHmBMSMXbUM

Oh my GOD!!... What a freakin' Squid!!!  This guy was like Dog-paddling the whole 2nd half of the climb.. the nimrod couldn't get his feet back on the bike... that's why he flipped it.  Not having the feet on the pegs... his body naturally slides back and then at some point causes him to crank on the throttle when his arms are fully extended, unable to do anything about it.