Author Topic: Comp release? Kill button?  (Read 14044 times)

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Offline Brute

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Comp release? Kill button?
« on: September 14, 2014, 08:11:59 AM »
For you SuMo guys out there. I have been playing with the corner entry using the kill button on my KX5 SuMo. The 'run on' is particularly disturbing to me as it is fairly violent with the big 500 one lunger. I have tried just pulling in the clutch but if I do not get the RPM right when I am starting to add power it is not smooth either.
I am considering moving the kill switch and placing it on a bracket right below the throttle tube for easy thumb access. The kill switch seems to be the smoothest of the options so far. There is less 'jump' when I take the thumb off and the engine is at the correct RPM for the gear I am in.
The other thing to try would be a cable compression release in place of the 'starting only' one.
Opinions? Suggestions?
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Offline sandblaster

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2014, 01:52:22 PM »
With the lighter flywheel mine does shorter less violent 'Run On'
But that sounds like a possible solution.
The four stroke engine: That's one stroke for producing power and three for wearing the engine out.

Offline Brute

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2014, 02:37:01 PM »
Mine has the light one also but I never did any real asphalt with it even when it had the stock one and the heaviest added weight. Dirt was much more forgiving in that sense.
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Offline tobys 2 strokes

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2014, 08:41:05 AM »
jafab had built a cable operated one for the 14mm releases cant seem to find a pic. I was always going to copy it for mine but never got around to it.

http://www.kxriders.com/forums/index.php/topic,6545.0.html


Offline Brute

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2014, 10:12:07 AM »
Omar's Dirt Racing has one with a one way valve so no crap gets sucked back in but it is also 14mm.
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Offline Buzz Killington

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2014, 01:39:02 PM »
Wouldn't a rekluse clutch help it to freewheel?

Offline RoostiusMaximus

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2014, 01:50:32 AM »
get the pulse intake system on it, I ride hare scrambles etc on my pulsed CR5. There are times where I'll get into open areas and run the bike up 10k+ in 3rd and then get braking for a corner that's needing to be entered in 1st and low throttle, I won't have a single run on surge.

Offline Dutch-K5 Fan

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2014, 06:02:48 AM »
get the pulse intake system on it, I ride hare scrambles etc on my pulsed CR5. There are times where I'll get into open areas and run the bike up 10k+ in 3rd and then get braking for a corner that's needing to be entered in 1st and low throttle, I won't have a single run on surge.

Pulse intake system ??

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-COMPRESSION-RELEASE-KIT-BULTACO-HUSQVARNA-MAICO-KTM-PENTON-ROKON-CAN-AM-/111486509476?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19f51d21a4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeqV8uWwAKw
I have something like this own on my AF works great for starting. Haven't tryed it for braking.
Didn't dirttrackers used it for braking???

Dutchie

Proud owner of a KX500AF


Offline dirk_411

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2014, 12:02:41 PM »
I run the pulse charged system on my tecate 4 with a 1998 kx250 top end. I am going to buy my 2nd kx500 in as many months, one stays as a bike, the other gets the motor swapped into another tecate 4 I'm building, everything will be pulse charged.  Here is a little description from Ron himself, I was asking him about the. Carb on the K5 I bought, but none the less here is a little info.

"Good move.  A Pulsed Charged KX 500 makes amazing power.  The Boyesen Rad Valve works excellent with Pulse Charged motors.  It looks like  you have a have a Sudco Pro Series PWK 41mm carburetor.  Pro Series PWKs are a much sought after high performance mod for stock inducted motors. 
 
There are two or three different Keihin, PWK carburetors.  Air Strikers have shark like fins located on the bottom of the air horn that direct more air flow across the fuel nozzles.  These wings when combined with Continuous Flow Induction and my carb mods create awesome 4-stroke like torque and amazing top-end over rev.
 
Because Continuous Flow Induction is pumping air-fuel through the carb even when the reeds are closed, the nozzle (it’s the rather large ½ pipe that sticks up in the throat) is no longer obstructing air flow and I fill the slide, my modified Air Striker flows more air-fuel and makes more power than a Pro Series 41mm carb.  The stock slide notch deflect air and sets up a negative vortex right above the fuel nozzle.  I also add a small ½ moon notch at the bottom of the slide.  This notch in conjunction with the smooth slide draws fuel from the main circuit even when the throttle is closed to create awesome throttle response.  This is especially important on a monster 500 motor!  Ron, Pulse Engineering"

Offline Brute

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2014, 06:53:28 PM »
Ummm, well, hmmm. Went to the web site and looked at the pics. Guess I am still unsure what that does? Perhaps one of you other folks can 'splain it to me in easy to understand terms?
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Offline RoostiusMaximus

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2014, 01:45:37 AM »
I wrote this up for another forum, I've worked pretty close with Ron on making the CR5 model work.  



Pulse Induction, an explanation


Most guys are under the mis conception that everything is inward like the red lines in this drawing show.




In reality the crankcase pressure closing the reeds makes a reversion wave that travels back towards the air filter picking up fuel for a second time as it passes the metering system and almost completely stalling the inward flow. Blue lines represent the reversion.




Now we understand that the actual inbound mixture has a triple metered wave and a single metered wave drawn into the engine. As the wave is drawing fuel on its reversion pass it is also back feeding the fuel circuit and forcing the fuel from the carburetor metering back to the bowl which causes the first 10-20% of the inward bound charge to draw a leaner mixture until the fuel returns.
The strength of the reversion wave is altered not by the crankcase compression of the motor, but by the crankcase volume. It's this reason that a 125cc motor takes a 192 main jet, a 250 is 180, and the 500's a 172 (average jet requirement). Lesser pulse wave strength on smaller motors means less multiplied fuel so an initial larger jet is needed. This lower strength wave makes a pulse unit less effective on small cc motors. It is not uncommon to see the surge of the stock reed boot on a CR500, the appearance of the boot absorbing this pressure does not have any measure able difference when compared to the wave in a rigid inlet like the Boyesen Rad Valve .
 




A Pulse Induction system replaces the stock boot that mates the reed to carb, its cone shaped chamber traps the majority of the reversion wave (blue) and channels it into the pulse tube where a specific length tube dictates the time for it to be re-introduced as an inbound charge. Metering of the fuel has now been almost perfectly restricted to a single pass of the metering system which no longer is having fuel forced out of it. The single metering pass has now given us an acurate and predictable means of metering the fuel. Commonly the jet sizes need to be increased since they are no longer working on multiplied passes. Throttle response is crisp since you are no longer stalling the inlet stream 1/2 the time
Here you can see the reversion waves time has it half ways back to the plenum while the reeds are still closed.




Timing of the pulse wave set by the length of the tube introduces the wave to the chamber as the reed opens, adding velocity to push the almost stalled inlet stream (red). With the inertia wave more air is introduced than the motor can otherwise draw on its own because it is starting at a velocity equal to what is created 1/3-1/2 of the time into the standard intakes draw, basically its "supercharged". The Pulse system works from idle to high rpm and close to wide open throttle positions since its re-introduction point is post throttle valve. Commonly the engines will not draw fuel consistantly through the rpm range because of the reversion strength, The pulse equipped motors will continue to draw consistantly and evenly to extended rpm ranges not accessable without pulse induction. Intake tempatures are reduced since additional single metered air is aquired and engine tempatures are reduced significantly to where it is reccomended to run a heat range hotter spark plug than normally used.




I've done my best to explain this, I expect questions and have no problem answering them.
Adam Millar
« Last Edit: November 07, 2014, 01:52:55 AM by RoostiusMaximus »

Offline dirk_411

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2014, 03:41:22 AM »
Great explanation Roost. I recall Ron mentioning your name now that I see it, Adam right?

Offline Brute

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Re: Comp release? Kill button?
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2014, 03:55:19 AM »
Excellent explaination! Interesting. Not sure how it would keep it from having the 'run on' though. Fuel is still being introduced? Seems like it would smooth out the mixture but not sure how it would keep the fuel building up in the crankcase and into the cylinder on deceleration.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2014, 03:58:23 AM by Brute »
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