question on timing

[kawdude]

All,
My KX has always been a beotch to start.  I wondering about where the timing marks should be aligned.  It seems that I've read the retarding or advancing the ignition may help this issue.

[gowen]

Hey,

It could be a few things. I was having your same issue, but mine ended up being the jetting way off. The mark should be on the center of the three. You might have to experiment with them. Make sure your choke is working! You might consider changing to an EIX (iridium) because it can take a weak ignition and make it spark like a good ignition. Consider maybe changing your ignition system for a new one if found weak. I believe I have one laying around somewhere, since I don't use it anymore. Goodluck and let me know.

[Spider]

Make sure your kickstart lever is set to get a full throw, any thing less won't do.

Dale

[kawdude]

I've been screwing with the jetting for some time now and the closed thru 1/4 throttle seems good.  I doubt the ignition is the best.  I had a EIX plug in it and lost spark the last time I was riding.  I replaced with a plug out snowmobile that's been sitting since 85 and the spark had to be ten times brighter.  Started and ran good.  I'm not sure what to do to make this start easier.  I'm about ready to sell it.

[kawdude]

Make sure your kickstart lever is set to get a full throw, any thing less won't do.

Dale

It is.  Right now I'm having a problem with the kick start not grabbing in the Illinois cold.  I'm sure it's wore but probably related to too thick a oil being used.

[hughes]

The kick start gear is located to high to sit in oil. It's worn out. Pull the clutch cover and inspect the ratching gear and springs. My 87 500 likes to be leaned over on it's left side untill gas poors out the vent line and then I pull the choke kick it once push choke down kick it agian with a little throttle. Playing with my pilot jet and air screw helped alot on mine. Before I played with the jetting I would half to install a new plug ever time I wanted to ride it or just to get it to start. now with cold temps here in North Georgia she trying to act up alittle.

[kawdude]

Agreed the gear does not sit in oil but the oil lubes the shaft that ratch gear slides on.  I don't doubt that either the shaft, gear or both are wore out but this problem was not around until I used Max gear lube.  Heck that's about the only remaining original piece of the motor.

[hughes]

Drain that Max Gear oil and use ATF type f. That 's all I used this past year with great results. Shifts butter smooth. I have never heard of Max Gear oil is it made for motorcycle trans??

[kawdude]

Yeah its the maxima brand.  It's a good oil but probably too thick for cold weather.

[Johnniespeed]

kawdude, dont give up and dont sell it. My kx500 starts super easy, 2nd or 3rd kick cold and first kick hot.
 What that means, is that yours, can start easy too. An oil change shouldnt take more than ten minutes. LOL  I havent had my kickstart gear out of the kx yet, but my red bike took less than ten minutes to pull the clutch cover off and the kicker gear and shaft slides right out. Perhaps others from this forum know more about the ignition weakness, my opinion is that the spark plug is probably the weakest link. Also the cheapest part to buy. I think Gowen is right about using the center mark. There is a jetting chart in the download section of this forum. Do you rock the bike in gear first before kicking? Because I am not real tall (5'8") I sometimes use a milk crate or picnic table to stand on while kicking. I have found that by raising "ME" up I can apply much more force and speed to the "kick" I always wear motocross boots when kicking and I put my body,mind and soul into every kick. Hope this helps! Dont give up!

[kawdude]

I don't rock it but will attempt to do so.  It's more of a deal to take the side cover of the kx but not hard by any means.  When I rebuilt the engine last year, which consisted of top and bottom end plus all the bearings, I set the timing at the middle mark but it may have slipped.  I wouldn't doubt the ignition is weak.  I bought this two years ago as an ebay "low hours" bike...BS!  It was beat to crap internally and externally.  I'm about your height also and use a stand which helps a bunch.  Kaw did a crappo job designing the placement of the kickstarter and that lever has tore up numerous pairs of shoes.  The jetting for this bike seems correct at the bottom but definately not at the top.  Gowen and I both have had the Eric Gorr treatment done to topend so the jetting has been difficult.

[fast99]

dont sell it, (unless you give us on this site a good deal first) jetting!! at 6500 feet here in the white mountains of arizonia took a couple of attempts then found this site and the very accurate jetting charts here, now no problem starts even down to 8 degrees (thats cold and i didn't ride very far before i came back for a hot toddy) But anyway i have seen to many people try to run to thick of oil (especially when weather cools) in dirt bikes. the factory recommended oil in ALL years of the K5 is MOTOR OIL 10W40l i have been useing castol 15/40 in my 99 K5 for years with no shifting, clutch, or kick start problems from well over 110 degrees to 5 degrees (far). just my 2cents worth. again if you must sell do it here first.

[kawdude]

I'll sell it here first!!!  The kicker issue is a little of both...its wore and its cold.  Onde the engine is hot it the kicker doesn't slip.

The jetting issue is another thing.  The last time I rode it was d**n good to half throttle.  Beyond that it was rich or the exhaust valves are hung up.  If I decrease the main jet the bike starts having the famous 500 popping when the engine comes down from higher RPM.  If I remember correctly it does the same thing if the clip is leaned out also.  I think Gowen experimented with different needles and dialed it in that way.

The 1st $1500 will take it!!!

[gowen]

I'll sell it here first!!!  The kicker issue is a little of both...its wore and its cold.  Onde the engine is hot it the kicker doesn't slip.

The jetting issue is another thing.  The last time I rode it was d**n good to half throttle.  Beyond that it was rich or the exhaust valves are hung up.  If I decrease the main jet the bike starts having the famous 500 popping when the engine comes down from higher RPM.  If I remember correctly it does the same thing if the clip is leaned out also.  I think Gowen experimented with different needles and dialed it in that way.

The 1st $1500 will take it!!!

If I did not have so much money tied into my KX, I'd sell it. I'm having the same issues as your KX, except for the jetting part. The d**n kick starter doesn't grab. Currently, I just purchased an inline four that I'm going to build to replace it. But, I'll always have my 500, it is just going to be in the back of the garage from now on. I don't have the time, since I just moved last month to VA. What is bad, when I lived in the city, I used to ride more than I do now that I have land to ride all day long. It's funny how that works. I guess I'm getting old too.

Good luck with the sell!

[barryadam]

I've not fully cured my hard starting either.  Cold starts (first of the day) have been easier since I followed the group's recommendations on procedure.  I have also recently made some jetting changes to bring it closer to the forum recommended settings.  I'm not getting good results now on hot restarts or restarts after sitting for an hour or so.  The remaining step is to up the main jet from 155 to 160-165.    

My ears perked up when hughes mentioned a new plug each time.  I had the best luck when I had a fresh BR8EG.  Could that be a sign of a weak ignition coil?  stator?  CDI?  Or has anyone else experienced that?  The timing is spot on the middle mark.  The primary coil winding measures 1.0 Ohms (spec = 0.31+/- 15%); the secondary measures 8.19K Ohms (spec = 3.1K +/- 15%), so technically, it is not to spec.  Anyone else measure their coil?  Have not checked the CDI resistances or the stator coil yet.

Unfortunately, the more people I ride with, the more I've got to make excuses for that embarassing starting situation.  Once it's running, I hesitate to shut it off unless I have a big downhill in front of me.

B